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    PQ | Features | Mailbag | Apr 14, 2000
   

PQ Mailbag

E-Mail, E-Mail..

Roly poly e-mail.. And sweet sassy molassy, did we get a lot of it this week! Tons of mail came in regarding Lee'Mon's editorial, and I've had to read all of it. I didn't think it was physically possible for my eyes to get tired, but I think they are. But I digress. We've got an action packed PQ Mailbag for you this week, with a whole page each for Lee'Mon's editorial and The Gauntlet, and a third page of odds, ends, and Graeme Devine. And it's all just a little bit of history repeating..

Netiquette Schmetiquette

There I go, inventing words again. Lee'Mon had some words for all the trash talking l33t h4x0r types this week in his amazing editorial "A Return To Netiquette". Many intelligent responses were cultivated, and here they are for your reading pleasure.

From: hawkeye MI
Subject: Feedback on the editorial about l337 kW@kr d00d's, etc...

There is a solution to the problem addressed in the editorial. It is not, however, easy or for one person alone.

The whole situation has arisen for one reason and one reason only. Stupid people. I do not say this jokingly. Back in "the day" (yeah i know...) when I really got into computer games, there was Quake. Now, any of you who have ever installed a mod for Quake one, tweaked configuration files, messed with GLQuake, or anything of the like know that you had to know at least a *little* about how to operate a computer. Stupid people aren't good at that. Also, with all the effort required to get online (set-up, etc...) and stay there comfortably, some dedication to the game was required.

Now, when I started playing FPS's quite a bit, I was probably, oh, 13 or 12 or something. I had heard some negative comments about how annoying younger players were, but I did none of the things these people were said to do. I thought there were, perhaps, only a few such cases, and for the most part I was right. The above troubles sort of weeded out morons. That is no longer the case. Any twit with a computer can easily get online now. Scratch that barrier. Ever used the menu in Quake III Arena? Scratch the ease-of-use barrier. Need to invest lots of money in a 3D accelerator / system hardware? Not anymore. Now I go to the local Gamer's Conclave for some low-ping LAN fragging and discover a bunch of whiney little middle school kids who play Counter-Strike like deathmatch, and scream "I r00l j00!" verbally rather than bothering to type it in. They have been allowed easy access. When easy access is opened, stupid people get in. It is that way in any sport, (yes i count deathmatch as a sport), some more than others. It is so bad at that LAN that I just go home and play on my 56k, awaiting the DSL that will probably never reach this hellhole i just moved to. (sorry about the rant.) But that's okay too.

Ah, those people who whine all the time. You know, I always sort of looked at slightly higher ping as an advantage, in that once I excelled on a server despite my ping, it gained respect. The game is a challenge, which cheating eliminates, and therefore eliminates the point of the game. I look at lag the same way. (well, until it his 500 or so... then i just say screw it).

I said something about a remedy. Here it is. Just as with campers, this problem has to be treated with a no holds barred kamikaze type dedication, coupled with skill. The best way to root out a cheater (on a server) or a whiner or whatever is to go after him exclusively. If all *good* players in the community followed this example, i think these idiots would mend their ways rather quickly. Imagine this scenario. You are on a server, and some l337 d00d is whining about his connection/spamming/being an arsehole. If there was a recognition of this by aforesaid *good* players, and everyone stopped killing each other for a moment and just went after him until he stopped/left, i think the problem would be solved quickly. The ability to identify players on sight built into most new games would facilitate this easily.

Finally, in order to make all this possible, PRACTICE!! I know not everyone has all the time in the world to practice, and it is not as fun, but the best way to be able to eliminate these people is to go play Q3A with the hardest difficulty bots for a while so they beat you really bad. I owe my l337 $k|llz (j/k) to some old Level 3 ReaperBots.

Cooperation is the key. Let's keep the community together, make an effort. HawkeyeMI out.

HawkeyeMI[fzm]

Hellchick: Actually, I had a better idea as soon as I read your theory on stupid people, but unfortunately the law frowns on that kind of thing.

From: Rick 'r3tina' Laman
Subject: A return to...plain old fun

Hello,

I hope Lee'mon was exaggerating enormously, and wrote this piece just to get some people to mail about it, 'cause it didn't make any sense. His little introduction to so-called hax0rspeak is completely true as far as I can see it, but if I can remember correctly, the first time I ever saw this hax0rscript actually being used was...on PlanetQuake. I don't know who started this (it could've been Fargo...) but at the time no-one seemed to have a problem with it.

Why I think this article is absolute nonsense? Well, to begin I'm a member of a 'clan' called the pr0nMaster Quake Clan. Or, as Lee'Mon would call it, a '[..] wannabe clan, those that hammer on the Taunt key, and our more annoying newbies'. I'm sure those types of people are extremely annoying (and sometimes they are) but the reason we called our clan (it's not really a clan but more a group of friends who organize LAN-parties once every 3 months or so) the pr0nMaster Quake Clan is because it's all a JOKE. Ha><0rscript is not something to take seriously, and it's absolutely not a way to say 'I'm a elite hacker, blah blah blah'. It's just something you can use for the fun of it, nothing more, nothing less. We don't take ourselves seriously (at least not our l33t h4><0r sk1llz), and simply play Quake because of the fun of it. And it doesn't matter if that's online, at a LAN-party or against a bunch of bots. It's simply good fun, and it's supposed to stay that way.

For the rest of the article, I agree mostly to the pieces about cheaters and the trashtalk you can encounter. I don't think there's much anyone can do about that. The Internet has become more and more a 'public area', with all the annoyances that come with it. It's a shame, but it's not something which is easily changed.

Oh, and by the way, Lee'mon states in his article (quote) '...and knowing someone who was making a mod was like knowing somebody famous...'. While I don't know anyone who's making a mod, I was very proud when my map was featured on ..::Lvl (and thus on the frondpage of PQ). So it's not like 'the good old days' are completely gone. I for one still think that being part (more or less) of the gaming community is something special.

I hope Lee'Mon's next editorial will be a bit more positive.

With regards,

Rick 'r3tina' Laman (and r3tina is spelled with a 3 because Retina was already taken at Yahoo!...)

Hellchick: Wow, to think that PQ was the instigator of all things h4X0ring...that's just rad. I'm going to therefore attempt to start a new trend and see how quickly it catches on. I'm not sure what it will be yet, except that it will probably involve chickens. Possibly waffles as well.

From: Douglas Petranoff
Subject: Lee'mon's Editorial

Here's a possible poll question..

Which of the following "arsehole" groups ,which Lee'mon describes in his editorial, does Lee'mon himself fit into?

A.) L337 h0x3r d00dz
B.) Whining Llamas
C.) Cheaters
D.) Braggarts
E.) Script Kiddies/Spammers

And the answer is obviously?

B.) Whining Llamas

Lee'mon needs to take his own advice as SHUT THE FUCK UP! All these groups ruin the game only because Lee'mon allows them too.

As he says, it's just a game. The hacker speak is annoying but so blatantly obvious that it is actually humorous.

As for the guys that whiners/ well for every finger you point Lee'mon, three point back at yourself.

As for the Cheaters, since you pointed out that losing is not that big a deal and that people need to suck it up when they lose, then who cares. If the other player cheats to win, have the REALLY won? Obviously no. Besides that, the mod community is actively fighting this and there are anticheat measures out there, so play on servers without them, but don't complain about people cheating, as you said, it will do little good.

As for the braggarts, answer them with your skills, if you cannot, ignore their taunts. Afterall it is Just a Game.

As for script Kiddies and Spammers, the spammers can be ignored and there are few if any scripts that can perform any task with the perfection that a skilled player can. Again, If you opponent needs that crutch, you're still the better player. Since we're just having fun, it is alot like giving a friend a handicap in a friendly game of golf.

I think if Lee'mon we're to spend less time whining about these assholes, his perception would change and at the very least those bad dreams would go away.

3y3 f00kin 0wn j00 with my ph4t zbot 4nd qu4d t1m3r, j00 whining llama!

sac|Tsunami

Hellchick: How does not complaining about something change your perceptions about it? If I stop complaining about Col. Grossman and his legion of moral do-gooders, they're still ignorant jerks.

From: Lee David
Subject: A Return to Netiquette / feedback

I think you guys forgot a group

Hyper-emotional antisocial moaning wussies

These are the dudes who think they are the world because their mostly veterans in the community who for some reason didn't manage to emotionally deal with the newbies. These people expect almost anyone they don't know to drop down on their knees and start begging for mercy, if they don't they'll just be rated ass arses for some pathetic reason (mostly just invented because they can't find a proper reason).

I've been playing since the launch of Wolfenstein and (thanx to our crappy internet providers) joined into the online community in the time of Q2. I've totally humiliated many people in combat, but also suffered the same losses. I've seen lot's of different enemies, great fraggers, campers, cheaters, spammers, wannabees. Some where good, some were a pain in the arse, others just got fragged, but I still more or less could understand the situation of each of them and tolerate them all, except the cheaters that is.

What I never could accept were the guys who don't like cussing, using keybinded words and agressive behaviour. It get's even worse when these people start wanting to bring up trash talk in game. I remember meeting a clan on the net, because it wasn't the first time we met me and my clanmates decided to start a clanwar against them. At first all was fun, we were swearing and having fun, until I told that my clan will kick his clans arse (hoping to keep up the status of clanwar, because it's fun). Heavily insulted he started complaining to me about my agressive behavior, WTF is this, did I hurt his feelings or what¿ can't he sleep at night anymore because of me¿ Is he affraid I'd beat him up¿ What the hell is with these touchy people, are they also insulted when they lose against a bot like Klesk, Hunter or Visor who all have screaming or laughing taunts¿ I don't wanna know how the community would look if there were only these people, probably weapons in Quake would get replace with flowers or a hand for playing catch or hide and seek.

I'm not telling people to act like assholes in real life, when I meet people @ LAN's I'm also social, but not when I'm playing, that's where I get rid of my agressions.

Anyway that's my opinion, the Quake communities is OK, and those who really are Arses mostly don't stand a chance anyway, else they would be proud of their name and stop laming.

Hellchick: I'm just the opposite -- I like to say that stuff in real life so people are really afraid of me.

From: Peter Schittler
Subject: Lee'Mon's A Return to Netiquette editorial

Where can I sign it, where can I sign it?

Well-done stuff from PQ again. You're proving that PQ is the main authority re online gameplay and not just one of the big download sites with some news. Lee'Mon actually is touching a subject which is giving governments around the world tons of headaches: How to give the community maximum freedom while not limiting individual freedom because some individuals abuse this freedom?

If you check real life, then you'll see that it was practically impossible to solve that matter so far.

Is it impossible to find a solution for the Quake community too? I'd still say no - we have some chances.

Pappy-R was right when he said he leaves those servers. I do as well. In my online neighborhood, I know where the good servers are and which ones not to hop on. Freedom of choice is our strongest weapon. A server not used by all is a server that dies - or concentrates all those folks we don't feel belong to us; I can live with both ways. But as an unused server usually won't make the admin proud, can we add some oil to the fire? Would it be a good idea to put up a special page on PQ with a form-letter where everybody just has to fill in the server's address, an admin-e-mail and off the mail goes to the server owner, telling him that his server - pardon me! - sucks? Putting this on a group effort (without the need to build up lists 'cause that could lead to abuse as well) with the same letter to every admin could cause some reactions.

So what should these poor admins do then? Hm. If I had a server and may happen to be online when some fella spits out his unnecessary stuff, I'd kick him/her immediately. Freedom and democracy ok, but on my server the community would not suffer from a destructive individual. So is there a way to make this task easier for admins?

Well, dear coders, you have been very active about bot detection. Why not, to talk about the guys who tell poor Lee'Mon he sucks, code some _generally usable_ code every mod author could add which scans the text messages and compares them with an admin-adjustable text file containing those 'dirty' words? I mean, none of us ever will have the reason to use words and phrases like "You suck", "motherfucker", "asshole", etc. (Even if we feel that way, we won't go to the same level, right?). Why not brutally kicking everyone off who uses these words (and not too surprising, the vocabulary of these people is rather small).

You may feel this is a step to drastical (note: PQ folks, correct me if my English may not be proper in all places! It's not my mother language), but, as said right at the top, I feel there is a point where actions have to be taken to secure the freedom and fun for those who stick to the rules. If that may mean limiting the 'rights' of those who abuse the friendliness we generally offer everyone, well, ok, fine with me.

After all, I _know_ that I simply leave a server where I don't feel at home. I feel at home if I win and if I lose although I like the first more, I admit. The only reason to chat for me is to greet people (well, my momma told me you just say hello if you enter or leave a room *g*) and to congratulate some guy on a perfect shot - even if I was the target. Sending over "great shot, pallie!" makes the whole place smile, I know this. Ok, as they say, just my 2c.

Finally, I urge PQ to put their fingers on the wounds of the community again and again. Keep up the good work!

Peter

Hellchick: I'm with Pappy on this one. Just leave the server if you don't like it. Lord knows people do it when I jump on. Er, wait...

From: Alex Leonard
Subject: Response to: A Return to Netiquette

And lo did Lee'Mon open his mouth and spew forth such pearls of wisdom that the Quake community was bathed in the light of revelation!

I don't think I could say enough great things about what Lee'Mon has said in this editorial, he's said it all. I know that I have been driven away from playing online as often as I used to (And my skizzles[sic] have suffered greatly!) preferring to play at LAN parties where I know everyone, and I know that people aren't going to be whining, cheating, spamming, hax0rsp33king (Except in the occasional jest ;)

I live in fear of real-time voice communication in Team Fortress 2. I live in fear in general of individual user defined content like the decals in Half-Life. Most of them are just designed to be offensive. Rarely do I find someone using a decal other than something like: "You Suck! wh0r3s!" Or something like that.

I wish there was more that could be done about such behavior, you can't exactly send someone to the principals office in the middle of a game to "Think about what they've done" and if they get booted/banned from a server, it's not so big a deal because there's plenty of other servers out there for them to annoy people on. Going through a "screening process" and slapping a password on all the servers so that you know there's nobody on a particular server who's using a bot, or is going to whine seems really extreme, and too much of a hassle.

The fact remains that over the internet, everyone is fairly safe behind their monitor and miles of cables. A lot of people don't realize that they're really interacting with other people. I can almost guarantee that if you were sitting across the table from these people, close enough to clock them in the head, they'd behave themselves. ;)

Trakman

--Komet

Well before Lee'Mon busts in with his feedback, I'll give mine. Holy poop. 124 e-mails on this one subject. That's got to be a record, or damn near it. Lee'Mon has reached his pinnacle here; I don't recall an editorial having touched the community so much as this one has. Anyways.. I'll tell people they suck and spout h4x0r 5p33k at them, but only when I'm playing my friends, on a private server. There I find it absolutely fine. I use it for humor purposes only. On public servers, I just shut the hell up. I ignore things other people say, for the most part, except when they say, "Hey, you're that really cool Spyke guy from PQ, right?" Then I tell them of course I am. Sometimes it's hard to ignore taunting bastards, but I, personally, have found them to be a rarity; I guess I just live around considerate people. It's hard to get smack-talkers to change, but I hope a lot of them read this editorial and wake up.

Lee'Mon: While I counted all those emails, and made every effort to read most of them, I didn't have to pour over them as thoroughly as Spyke did. Let's see if he ever complains about not getting feedback again! Mwah hah hah, MWAH HAH HAH HAH HAH!!! [blinks] Whoops... is this thing still on?M

Yes, I'm fully aware that the worst thing llamas can do is get your goat, and that's something you can control. You didn't see me swearing off multiplayer or anything, so don't worry too much. It is sad to see, however, that some of the most prominent members of our community (at least in the servers) are the most annoying ones. I sincerely hope that it is an age and immaturity thing, because that gives the best hope that it'll clear up in the future. Perhaps the gaming community just needs to expand to include more parents... ;^)

Anyhow, the editorial was designed to bring in more feedback than I normally get, but I never expected this much. I guess I'll have to be careful with this newfound feedback power... I must use it for good and not eeeevil. [brings pinky finger to mouth]

On Page 2: Gauntlet Feedback Galore!


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